Belief in the Disir

[JeffSinger]

Admin: Derail split from The Heathen Worldview thread.

I really dont know what else to say to be honest, all of the above is what the ancestors in general belived.

Religions change and grow, some things become less important. As far as the spirirts of the dead go, dead woman become Dis, protectors guiders (Gaurdian angels, along with your personal Norn who is also a Dis) they bestow luck and fortune and shit like that. Dead men (and woman) become honored ancestors, examples to live up to. Offerings are made so that they will be happy and comfy in their new realm (Imo offerings is symbolic to the person)

[Bathilde]

How do we know dead women become dis?

[JeffSinger]

Thats heathenism, if your a Germanic Pagan thats the sets of belifes you hold, its an intergal part of it, basically if you dont belive that your not a Germanic Heathen, its like being catholic and not beliving in immaculate conception.

[JeffSinger]

i suppose you dont know it you choose to belive it. To me Dis are symbolic of the example our female ancestors gave us. Science is great, i belive in the scientific method, yet it hasnt discovered every force at work in the universe, hell we hardly understand dark matter, whats to say there isnt more?

[Bathilde]

I'm germanic pagan, and I don't necessarily hold that belief. How do you reconcile that?

By the way, saying science hasn't discovered every force at work in the universe means nothing.

[JeffSinger]

Im not arguing with you, i am only saying we shouldnt dismiss the idea of spirits ect until we know for sure such a thing doesnt exist.

To not belive in Disir (a fundamental belife in the Norse cosmology) would as i said be like being Catholic and not beliving the emaculate conception.

One is allowed to belive however they wish but i disagree with people who "pick" and "choose" elements of a faith, christians for example do this alot.

my point about science was meant to put forth the idea that things like guiding spirits disir ect arnt outside the realm of possibility

Germanic peoples practiced the same basic faith for 40,000 years, how can someone just pop up one day and rip out a fundamental concept and call it the same thing?

[Bathilde]

Im not arguing with you, i am only saying we shouldnt dismiss the idea of spirits ect until we know for sure such a thing doesnt exist.

To not belive in Disir (a fundamental belife in the Norse cosmology) would as i said be like being Catholic and not beliving the emaculate conception.

One is allowed to belive however they wish but i disagree with people who "pick" and "choose" elements of a faith, christians for example do this alot.

I'm not norse.

Btw, everyone picks and chooses elements of their faith. For example, I'm not going to bring back human sacrifice.

Also, I think you mean immaculate conception, which is common for catholics to believe but isn't a requirement for them to be catholic.

Also, I'm going to combine your triple post combo(try using the edit button when not on your phone).

Germanic peoples practiced the same basic faith for 40,000 years, how can someone just pop up one day and rip out a fundamental concept and call it the same thing?

Yea, I'm gonna need some evidence that the same basic faith was practiced for 40k yrs.

[JeffSinger]

Nordic, Norse, Germanic, whatev er, same cosmology

It is a requirment to belive in the virgin birth to be a catholic, its like the biggest thing regarding that faith

Pointing out spelling errors and the edit button does not boost your argument and has nothing to do with the topic at hand ;p

Human sacrifice is not a requirment now or in ancient times, some people did it, it wasn't something you had to do.

The Disir are a fundemental part of Heathendom, one of the primary concepts. Frigga and Freya are Dis, Valks are Dis. Dis arnt some special sperate group, they are female ancestors, why would you choose not to recognize female ancestors?

Animism, belife in fertility gods and ancestors was the worlds religion from the neolithic onwards, few, if any people didn't practice those basic cocepts.

Germanic paganism just didn't pop up, it evovled over millenia from earliar belifes centering around the same concepts. Names of powers changed but the basic fundemental belifes did not.

This is supported by Anthropology and archeology as a whole

Excuse me, middle paleolithic

Even if it is not 40 its most certainly 10k

[Bathilde]

Jesus.....

My combining your posts had nothing to do with my argument(and I'll be combining them again). It's more about making it easier to reply. Correcting your spelling error also had nothig to do with my argument, it was just a correction. And I'll correct you again by pointing out the immaculate conception is not the virgin birth. Mary was conceived without sin, hence immaculate conception(fun fact: Mary's immaculate conception feast day is my birthday). Jesus had the virgin birth, according to their lore. And it's debated whether or not the "virgin" bit just meant "unmarried" or "never had sex". Why would you think any of this was my attempt at "boosting" my argument?

Also, norse germanic whatever, isn't exactly anglo-saxon which is what I am. There are differences. In fact, there were variations per tribe. Not everyone believed the exact same, just like today not every heathen believes the exact same.

Belief in the Idesa has several variations. Some think of the Idesa as Valkyrie, some think Goddesses, some think dead women, some think spirits of dead women, some think a divine female being. Some think it's all your female ancestors, some think it's the unbroken maternal line.

I'm going to need some sources for the 40k yrs of beliefs claim. And that animism, belief in fertility gods, and ancestors were the world's religion.

I don't disagree that beliefs evolved with time and germanic paganism did not just appear. But 40,000 yrs? I'm gonna need something to support that claim.

[JeffSinger]

Animism and its prevelence around the world and throughout history is just fact, its an easily researched topic, all you've gotta do is google it and all the sourced you need will be before you in endless supply

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